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  #1  
Old 03-19-2017, 07:31 AM
the_mask the_mask is offline
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Default X399, the new workstation champ?

Given the rumors surrounding the X399 platform (or whatever it might be called). It seems to be really coming and with the following characteristics:
  • 2 Zeppelin dies (up to 16 cores)
  • 4 DDR4 memory channels
  • Huge packaging (as big as Naples with 4 dies?)

The large package size bit is pretty interesting, as it could lead one to think that it might be there to satisfy the earlier rumours of a Zen + Vega large scale APU.

So an MCM between the 2, 8 core Zeppelin dies and a 64 CU Vega die which is connected to HBM2 via an interposer. A "Nano" version of the 225w Vega could be at 125w and 95w for the Zeppelin dies could mean stellar performance and high clocks at 220w for this huge combo.

This could potentially be the perfect chip for many workstation level workloads. Be it visual or compute or a mix of both

Add to that the capacity to may be have 2P systems and it will be totally untouchable by any other solution in the market. This could rock the data center as well.

Also the design is so flexible they can produce multiple variants along the 16+64, may be 12+48 or even 8+32.

Apple would be nuts not to use that for its next Mac Pro! Any workstation manufacturer should at least produce a line with these if they do come out.

That would be an awesome product if they manage to actually produce it and deliver it to the people!
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Old 03-19-2017, 01:11 PM
x800xtguy x800xtguy is offline
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Why not a single chip with 16C dual Zeppelin? Makes more sense to produce it.
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Old 03-19-2017, 01:14 PM
BioSehnsucht BioSehnsucht is offline
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I'll take "affordable" 16c32t chips if I can get them (i.e. not significantly more than 2x 1700(x) pricing, at similar clocks), especially if it's per-core cheaper than Naples.

But I don't have any use for an APU in such a socket... so hopefully if they offer that, they also off one without the packaged GPU die so that we can get more thermal headroom or simply lower thermals for better / same performance
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x800xtguy View Post
Why not a single chip with 16C dual Zeppelin? Makes more sense to produce it.
No why not two chips with 16C dual Zeppelins?
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:50 PM
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If AMD can modify XFR to allow a bit more granularity to clocking up cores when on lower threaded workloads - then this could be a great workstation.

***BUT*** if its gonna have a ceiling of ~3.0GHz, then that's maybe not good enough for the more interactive parts of any workflow which are typically much less multi-threaded. (i.e. CFD mesh generation.)
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Old 03-20-2017, 01:34 PM
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We have 1700 at 3.0ghz base and 65w TDP. Wouldn't two of those on an MCM just be a 130w chip? Am I missing something? Wouldn't this theoretical 16 core workstation CPU just be two 1700s taped together via an MCM?
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Old 03-20-2017, 02:35 PM
BioSehnsucht BioSehnsucht is offline
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Add a few watts for the extra links between dies, plus perhaps some extra PCIe lanes or what-have you, but certainly, should be able to do 2x 1700 in 150W for sure. You could probably do something between 1700 and 1800. The rumored < 3GHz clocks are silly at 150W.

Could probably cherry pick dies stable at lower voltages (i.e., would be nominally <60W dies) at 3GHz, and have 3GHz base at 125W even, with boost going well up to 150W+.
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Old 03-20-2017, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BioSehnsucht View Post
Add a few watts for the extra links between dies, plus perhaps some extra PCIe lanes or what-have you, but certainly, should be able to do 2x 1700 in 150W for sure. You could probably do something between 1700 and 1800. The rumored < 3GHz clocks are silly at 150W.

Could probably cherry pick dies stable at lower voltages (i.e., would be nominally <60W dies) at 3GHz, and have 3GHz base at 125W even, with boost going well up to 150W+.
Fudzilla states 2.4 - 2.8GHz so the 150W parts will defenitelly have clocks closer to 3GHz.
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Old 03-20-2017, 05:22 PM
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Personally speaking, I would live with the power budget of 2x 1800X.

The only time you'd approach that actual budget would be when you are doing heavy lifting - and lets face it - chances are turnaround time is more important than a few watts. These aren't going to be in high density servers.
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:57 PM
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Depending on your definition of "high density" (i.e. blades or just 2U chassis with no more than 2 sockets)...

For 2U chassis 2x 180W is already planned for Naples 32c/64t. Stretching that to ~200W shouldn't be too hard for a single socket that was 2x1800X performance, and as you say most of the time it won't even be at that power level. Overall cooling requirements would be lower, and only slightly higher per socket.

The real limiter might end up being how many pins they decide to put on the "workstation" socket vs Naples, as that may limit power delivery and thus possible clocks.
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