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Thread: AMD 14nm+ will be skipped, moved to 12nm

  1. #1
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    AMD 14nm+ will be skipped, moved to 12nm

    Looks like Zen 2 is delayed until the end of 2019 and a small refresh is planned for next year.
    Unless 12nm will be ready early next year, it is like 14nm+ an update of the 14nm process.

    Since they seem to talk about Ryzen and not Zen it must be also the Desktop CPU not only the mobile zen part.
    "Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kedas View Post
    Looks like Zen 2 is delayed until the end of 2019 and a small refresh is planned for next year.
    Unless 12nm will be ready early next year, it is like 14nm+ an update of the 14nm process.

    Since they seem to talk about Ryzen and not Zen it must be also the Desktop CPU not only the mobile zen part.
    12nm is an update to 14nm+ ( name change for marketing reason )

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    Quote Originally Posted by del42sa View Post
    12nm is an update to 14nm+ ( name change for marketing reason )
    Yes but that is not the important part, the important part is zen 2 much later than we hoped since now they said 14+/12nm will be used for a Ryzen update. (not only mobile)
    "Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere."
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    1+1 = 5 is what you are doing here.

    They also solely mentioned "client and graphics products". Not Zen. I still think it is highly likely this will only be used for APUs, and if any new Vega products appear.

    If Zen2 / 7nm products had slipped at least a year on the roadmap as you are claiming, AMD would be obligated to inform their shareholders. They have not done that.

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    I don't know what they really said I see all articles talking about Ryzen so I assume AMD mentioned Ryzen for 12nm.
    or did they all assume Ryzen without AMD talking about it? then we don't know more than before.
    "Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere."
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    14nm+ is the 12LP from GlobalFoundries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kedas View Post
    Yes but that is not the important part, the important part is zen 2 much later than we hoped since now they said 14+/12nm will be used for a Ryzen update. (not only mobile)
    The important part is, I have no idea what you are talking about. And probably no one does.

    Zen's roadmap exists for quite some time.

    2017: Zen
    2018: Zen Refresh
    2019: Zen 2
    2020: Zen 3

    I don't see any delay.

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    It was a possibility that 14+nm/12nm zen would only be for the APUs (Ryzen staying on 14nm until zen 2)
    If they say that 14+nm/12nm is also for Ryzen then they are not doing that effort if they are planning to short after launch zen 2.
    and risk production 14+nm/12nm is for 1H2018 meaning you can buy them by the end of 2018.
    So Zen 2 a significant time after that and then another year for Zen 3 give you launch Zen 3 end 2020, that is not what that roadmap shows.
    "Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kedas View Post
    Since they seem to talk about Ryzen and not Zen it must be also the Desktop CPU not only the mobile zen part.
    I'm not aware of the correlation here?
    CPU Grade [WiP]

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    Quote Originally Posted by gruffi View Post
    The important part is, I have no idea what you are talking about. And probably no one does.

    Zen's roadmap exists for quite some time.

    2017: Zen
    2018: Zen Refresh
    2019: Zen 2
    2020: Zen 3

    I don't see any delay.
    https://www.anandtech.com/show/11854...first-customer

    "GlobalFoundries expects to start risk production using the 12LP fabrication technology in Q1 2018. The company does not disclose any timeframes for HVM, but expect them to be different for various chip developers. For example, AMD is a very close partner of GlobalFoundries, so the company gets access to PDKs ahead of many other clients. That said, expect AMD to release its products made using the 12LP rather sooner than later. Mark Papermaster says that the aforementioned chips are to be released in 2018, but he does not elaborate whether to expect them in the first or the second half of the year."

    Well said. GF 12LP builds on the mature 14LPP process so we can expect GF to ramp quickly to HVM from risk production which will happen in Q1 2018. It looks like Zen on 12LP will arrive in early H2 2018 and similarly Zen 2 by early H2 2019.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kedas View Post
    It was a possibility that 14+nm/12nm zen would only be for the APUs (Ryzen staying on 14nm until zen 2) If they say that 14+nm/12nm is also for Ryzen then they are not doing that effort if they are planning to short after launch zen 2. and risk production 14+nm/12nm is for 1H2018 meaning you can buy them by the end of 2018. So Zen 2 a significant time after that and then another year for Zen 3 give you launch Zen 3 end 2020, that is not what that roadmap shows.
    Risk production for 12LP is Q1 2018. Moreover this is not a brand new process node which would normally take 12 months to go from risk to high volume production. This is an optimization of a very mature 14LPP node and thus the time to go from risk to volume production is likely to be a lot lesser. 12LP is what you would call a half node which used to happen back in the old days with processes like TSMC 55nm. I think Zen on 12LP will arrive in mid to early Q3 2018 and Zen 2 will launch in Q3 2019. AMD already confirmed that both Zen and Vega will be built using 12LP.

    "AMD's CPU and GPU roadmaps from earlier this year both listed a "14nm+" node, which at the time was a curious situation since GlobalFoundries didn't have a node between 14nm and 7nm. The obvious takeaway at the time being that GlobalFoundries was developing an interim node - an enhanced version of 14nm - which today's announcement finally confirms. In which case in accordance with Papermaster's official statement, it looks like we should be expecting both Vega and Zen products produced on 12LP in the next year."
    Last edited by fragman; 21st September 2017 at 08:14 PM.

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